90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I read an interesting article about ancient silver coins, it seems that copper and silver don't get together all that well and over the course of hundreds or thousands of years they'll start to seperate out and form brittle crystaline structures creating coins that can crack. If any of you guys out there are planning on living 2,000 or more years, I'd hurry up and trade out your 90% for .999+. :D

Anybody ever heard of any other kinds of aging effects in precious metals besides this, and tarnish of course? Though honestly I prefer nicely toned silver.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

It becomes more addictive as it ages...especially those walking liberty halves...

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Yes, the Walkers are really bad, but Mercury dimes are the worst for me. I'm going through withdrawl because I won't be able to make any more buys for a couple weeks, it's a killer!

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Bought my wife a little Greek silver coin from around 2000 BC, mounted in a necklace. Don't know what the silver content is, but it likely isn't .999.

But after 4000 years, it seems fine.

But another coin we have, Spanish piece of eight off the sunken galleon Nuestra Senora De Atocha, minted in 1621, has a large crack in it. Maybe 350ish years under water had something to do with that, though.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

god theyre beautifull...perfect size too...I hate to ever think of getting rid of any of them..ahahahah:character

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Yep, ..............got Morgans, Barbers, Walkers, Mercs, and Peace.........the older the better.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

The Mercury dimes are particularly disgusting. Yech! Every time I add to the 15000 of 'em in my collection, I must sit bent-over and breathe deeply to shake the overwhelming nausea I feel. I can't even look at them any more.

Other repulsive 90% coins inclued the Washington quarter -- uhg-gly! -- the Roosevelt dime, the Franklin half dollar -- gag! -- and the 1964 Kennedy halve. Like little round turds, essentially: no point in owning them. None at all.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Yeah, better let me hold on to 'em for ya so you won't hafta endure any more pain. :musicus:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

*Offers to take all those ugly 90% off everyones hands for free*

:cheerful:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Better Deal --> I'll offer you 'face' value for all your 90% ! :rofl:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

hehehe:hahaha:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

hehehehehehe
:D

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

In the event of monetary collapse or other catostrophic event, what happens when you try to barter with your 90% for goods, and the person you're trying to barter with doesn't realize the value of your 90%? Most folks under about 40 - 45 years old may not know about the silver content of old coins or have any idea about the relative values of copper, silver, gold, platinum, etc. etc.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Precisely.

I also believe that there is so little 90% left that it will never become widely recognized. I see it as bulk silver with free copper thrown in. If things get really bad, it will still have plenty of value, but you'll have to trade it through the right people.

Probably best to sell it all off before the collapse and go into weapons, drugs, prostitutes, and extortion. The locals will need order, in spite of all the blather about liberty. Specialists in violence -- people who are willing to go a little too far now and again -- will be needed. The sheep like their shepherds.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Drill, I need a slice of lemon with your wicked sense of humor. :haha:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

How easy is 90% silver to sell? Is it as easy to get rid of as SAE's or silver bars? Will your local coin shop buy it?

I've been looking at some 90% silver deals on EBay, and if I'm doing the math correctly, many are selling below melt value. Am I correct that the face value of a 90% silver coin times 0.715 equals the number of ounces of silver content? So at today's spot price of $14.51/ounce, each $1 of coin face value should be worth 0.715 * $14.51 = $10.37? In other words, the melt value is 10.37x the face value.

Here's a "buy it now" auction for $600 face value of silver coins for $6125. But 10.37 x $600 = $6222. So the "buy it now" price is about $100 less than melt value.

http://cgi.ebay.com/600-00-FACE-VALU...QQcmdZViewItem

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Your calculations are correct, but that auction probably started 3-4 days ago, when the price of silver was 0.60-0.75 lower. So he was asking for melt value in his buy-it-now price.

Of all the eBay 90% auctions I have followed in the past few months, if you bid melt value on the nose, you will usually be outbid. The prices there seem to float around 1% above melt.

There was this one lot of $75 in 1964 Kennedy halves, though: Ahh, that was a sweet score: one of the very few in my lifetime.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

That makes sense, but because it's a "buy it now" auction and still available, why hasn't somebody already snapped it up now that silver's spot price has rose? Selling for under melt value, shouldn't that be an obvious buy, or is there something else I'm missing?

If I buy these coins or something similar, will I be able to sell them again easily? Or is it worth paying an extra premium for other forms of silver that are more easily sold?

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I was wondering something similar to this also. When things go bad and you have to trade silver for food, the people who don't know the value of silver or other metals could care less about the silver you are offering. On the other hand, the "right people" who do know about silver and other precious metals (such as the ones on this forum) will have so much precious metals at that point and will be trying to trade it in for food, cothes, good, etc. So basically there wont be any demand for PM's. Only plenty of people trying to trade it away for goods?
Can someone explain to me what I'm missing here.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Right now Tulving is offering $1000 face for $10,181, delivered. So $600 face, at that rate, is $5,893. Keep in mind that Tulving is selling at $0.12 below spot for 90% right now. And this eBay auction will likely require $15-$20 for shipping and insurance.

The 300 Walking Liberty halves are a double-edged sword. If they are indeed VG-XF as the seller claims, then they'll have great resale value, but eBay sellers tend to grade, ahem, high. I have seen so many heavily-worn Walking Liberty halves that I don't wish to discuss it: too traumatic.

That auction is a reasonable offer, but not a hot deal.

As for 90% against other forms of silver, I think that any form is fine. 90% has the advantage of low (non-existent, really) premiums, divisibility, and a tendency to develop premiums of 10%-20% over other forms of silver in raging bull markets. We have yet to see that happen this time around, perhaps because the folks who can remember when it was real money are fewer in number these days. However, some still believe that 90% will at least equal the .999 in resale value at some point: I'm hesitant to say, but we'll see. There is never any question of authenticity of 90%, from dealers or other individuals.

As for .999 (1-oz rounds and bars of all sizes), the advantage is that you know precisely how much silver you're getting. To me this is not worth the premium: $50 for a 100-ounce bar right now.

In whatever form, you will be able to unload your silver for a good price. I have heard on this forum that large quantities of 90% are hard to move through some small local dealers, but I have never had this problem -- I'm not exactly known for selling silver, though.

Disclaimer, my holdings are around 2/3 90%, 2/9 in 100-ounce bars, and 1/9 in 10-ounce bars.

My biggest personal reason for holding mainly 90% is that I have a hard time believing that smelters will offer much less for 90% than for .999 as things heat up. Those bars, Eagles, and Maple Leafs will sure look beautiful as they're tossed into the crucible.

:hahaha: I also own 2.25 ounces of gold.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Silver recognition won't be a problem, because precious metals will be among the few forms of wealth that will hold value. Everyone will learn really quick. The people who will actually have the things you want will know what silver and gold are. It's not like you're going to be doing a lot of trading for things you want from sheeple... unless you would like to trade silver for a bag of toenail clippings and half a velvet Elvis.

Food is good to have, but it is subject to spoilage... except Spam. :spam4: Low sodium Spam is very high in vitamin C, as well. Excellent survival food, lots of calories, protein, vitamins and minerals per can and no shelf life. Yoo-Hoo in the bottle is good for these reasons, as well. Velveta does not need refrigeration after opening. If you had some hardtack you could have a nasty post-SHTF cocktail party... just bring viena sausages and potted meat product.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

eeewwwww, Rev127. That's a party I'm gonna be missing...

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

You'd be thankful for the Spam and Velveeta if your neighbors are chowing down on braised grasshoppers on a bed of steaming sawdust pilaf. If your neighbors had some silver they might offer you a silver half for that can of Spam.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

The Donner Party would have killed for that meal...

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Hopefully I have enough good food stored to avoid both of them...

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I still don't understand. Like stated above, the only people that will understand the value of silver will be the ones who already own silver. If you own a bunch of silver and a limited supply of SPAM, why would you accept someones silver for spam that is the only thing that is keeping your family from dying? Wont everyone be willing to trade there silver away for some food at that point? Hence, my stubborn mind not understand how silver will be the most valuable asset at that point

:hmmmm:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

It's strange, but gold and silver have maintained their value for thousands of years, through one collapse of a civilization after another. Obviously, food, etc., will be most valuable right after a collapse, but fairly soon afterwards (a year or two I'd say) silver/gold would be used for trading.

This is assuming it isn't the last collapse.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

It depends on the scope of the disaster we're talking about. In a long-term worldwide collapse, yes, the buying power of precious metals will likely not be very good because they have practically no value as survival tools. In a more limited disaster, you can trade some of your food for precious metals, and then when the disaster is over, be rich in precious metals and buy some things of greater value. Or if the disaster is localized, the precious metals still have value in the outside world where they can be used to purchase goods and services.

That's my point: It's not wise to put all of your assets into precious metals if you're preparing for a SHTF scenario. Precious metals can be a good trading medium, but only if there are people around who value them highly or if there's hope in a recovery. I'm reminded of an old Christian song from the 70's about the Tribulation. One of the phrases I remember is, "A piece of bread would buy a bag of gold. I wish we'd all been ready."

I am one who values PM's, but sometimes we need a reality check to understand that all the PM's in the world can't save your physical body or your soul.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

AAAAHH, I see. Awesome answer.

:hmmmm: is now :top:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Good thread.

I don't believe that PMs alone will save your bacon at TEOTWAWKI, and they're not at the top of my list of necessities.

But the human mind has an interesting tendency to value shiny objects even when starving. We don't act rationally, and many of us would forego a meal even when hungry if it meant piling up more gold.

It is what it is.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

It is a little more than just shiney object syndrome, there are practical limitations to bartering that make money a better deal. Imagine the following scenario,

I have a can of Spam and you want it. Bad. So you're willing to trade me the only 4 good tires in the whole county for my Spam. The trouble is I have a horse and no need for tires, though I do have an abundant surplus of Spam. I can't use the tires on my horse, and nobody else in the county as fuel or an operational vehicle, I'd have to lug my 4 tires over to the next county to find a guy who'd want them. He's well prepared and offers me 1 MRE for each tire. The problem is that I had to eat three cans of Spam to get the tire to him, plus I lost a can of Spam when I traded it for tires, so now I am down 4 cans of Spam, up 4 MRE's and I've lost three days I could have been doing something else. I may as well just have kept my Spam.

Or another scenario, you have a wife. She gets pregnant, has a baby, but needs a doctor to patch her back up afterward. No problem, there is a doc who makes the regular rounds throughout the county. He, like all doc's, is a highly trained professional who draws a high wage for his services. You are a chicken farmer. You agree to pay him something of great value that you have, 20 chickens. Problem. He's a doctor, not a chicken farmer. Not only does he not have a way to transport the chickens, but if he tries to clean them he'll be faced with the prospect of spoilage. So he says no way to the chickens. That's fine, you have a case of SKS's. So you give him an SKS rifle for his services. Then your neighbor does, and the guy down the block, and 5 guys in the next town... all the sudden doc is getting a hernia carrying around his 70lbs of guns and he still hasn't found anybody with a bottle of cognac which is the only thing he really wants or needs at the moment.

Wouldn't be a lot easier just to pass around a few universally recognized tokens, like gold or silver rounds? If it gets to the point that a loaf of bread costs an ounce of gold we're seriously @#$%! for other reasons.

Precious metals aren't the only thing you need, but they have always had and will always have for the foreseeable and much of the unforeseen future a special place as money, because it is very difficult to lug around anvils and millstones to some who cares who also has something you want.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Very well said, Metalophile. You aren’t alone in remembering the song “I Wish We’d All Been Ready” by Larry Norman. I hadn’t thought of that song in years and then as soon as I started to read GIM it started to pop back into my head.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
As others have said, in a total collapse food and water are going to be much more important initially than PMs. I personally don’t think I am going to see a EOTWAWKI situation in my lifetime (I’m in my 50s), but that doesn’t stop me from storing food, water, and PMs just in case. I figure the food and water can always be consumed before they go bad and IMO PMs are going to continue to gain against the dollar no matter what happens.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
It’s good to be prepared even if it turns out that the end of life as we know it doesn’t happen for another 200 years or not at all.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Sad, but true.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I probably would sell off half of my ninety at the first signs. Hopefully by then I have a fair amount of survival stores accumlated. What I would do with the money from the sale would to stock up on the so called "vice items" cigarettes and booze. Though I do neither, I firmly believe that they will be very good barter items.

m

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

NZ silver is now worthless, too. They should use this argument to get people to turn in their coins for the official government value.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

:hahaha: :hahaha: :hahaha: you are a gem D&F

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Rev, I enjoy 99% of your posts. But, this one......exactly what world are you describing here man? This would be how I envision things 50+ years after any societal collapse.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

The disintegration problem is one of the last things I am going to worry about! :cheerful:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Actually no, not each coin, each $1 face. The .715 oz of Ag pertains to one dollar face value. dimes would have .0715 each whereas quarters would have .17875 each. Halves likewise at .3575. Silver dollars have .7334 ozs each if memory serves. This only applies to pre 1964 coins. '65 to 70 were 40%.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Bumpiddy-bump.

:no_ma: Just a reminder: 90% is shite. :no_ma:


Utter garbage. As posters have pointed out here repeatedly, it is...how to put it nicely...problematic. :afraid:

Not a local dealer exists >cough!< who will buy these flattened silver turds masquerading as tokens of value.

Consider yourself warned, and stay away!

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Right now the smart money is offloading their crystalizing 90% at today's high prices and holding the cash. When silver corrects to $7/oz they will be backing up the truck! You can either get in on the action or sit on the sidelines.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

It was great to read this post of yours again, Drill. You must've been an author or writer of some sort at some point in your life. Great style, particularly in the use of the colon, which so few people take advantage of; and using "halve" in 1964 Kennedy halve, rather than half, shows great awareness. :bear_thumb: :bear_thumb: Definitely skills I appreciate, both the humor and the style. :bear_smile:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

The 1st time I read that I thought you were making a pun... I read it as ""The Older the Barter"!!! :coolbeer:

Then I re-read it to make sure... My wife was like :confused_m: Why you laughing at the Intraweb again???

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

D&F has upped the threshold to $7.50.:wink: Donkeys are weird like that. hehe

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

IMHO 90% silver should be bought at a 10% discount to spot.

Why you ask?

Because the if you ever take it to the refiner to get smelted, they will probably on only offer you 90% of spot for it because it is only 90% refined as opposed to .999 silver which they don't have to refine.

Look at the history of prices the smelters paid for in the big melts in the 80's. There are post on this board about it. If I am wrong about this, please inform me.

So..in the end analysis.

Buy .999 silver as close to spot as you possibly can
Buy .90 junk silver at 90% of spot
Buy .925 sterling silver at 90% of spot value

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I'll be braying in your face the day that $7.50 comes. It will happen.

Keep in mind that this will occur on the way down to REV127's $7 spot. You will all be left to watch, holding that silver you all bought at $11, as REV127 and I back up our fleets of vans.

Too bad. So sad.

Thanks, Krug, for the kind words. FWIW, I'm not sure about using "halve" there. "Halves" is the plural, but "halve" is more of a verb than a singular. "Half" is what we get when we turn an adjective into a noun -- short for "half dollar."

The donkey is confused, but not about the price of silver.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

You will get your $7.50 D & F, quite possibly soon. The $7 mark may even be today.

But that is for a half (too bad, halve doesn't work here) oz of silver.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

And everyone thought COMEX was manipulating the market.....It's D&F and REV. :banana:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I have a very sick and twisted love affair with morgan and peace dollars, i just keep buying them compulsively, i cant stop aaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

The good news is...well there is a lot of good news about silver. Too much to list lol.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Do you really see Silver heading to 7.00 an OZ ???
If so why???
I would be backing the truck up too then...

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

How are you buying them???

As bullion or just for silver, in sets, Slabbed, etc???

The cheapest I've seen'em in bullion is like 14.95 each...

I wouldn't mind having a few rolls in the old stash spot...

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

Try coins shows. I went last week and found a guy selling u-pick at $12.50 each. Had Morgans and Peace.
He also had a basket of u-pick for $15.00
Apmex sells culls pretty cheap in their wholesale page.

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

:bear_happy:
Indeed... it's not technically correct. I wouldn't cut a sandwich in half and say to someone "here's your halve" but would say "here's your half." And "half dollar" is definitely correct as you used it earlier in your original post. However, "the Kennedy halve" is definitely best, if only for style's sake. "The Kennedy half" is just plain wrong. The "Kennedy half dollar" would be fine, though. :haha: :bear_cool:

I've never known why but for some reason listening to, reading, and thinking about the English language and all its little eccentricities has always been something I've done, for whatever reason. Usually I'll just keep it to myself and get a little inward chuckle, but occasionally I'll point it out to others when it so strikes me.

PS - I like Kennedy dimes and halves. :bear_thumb: It'd be cool to have a big bathtub full of them, and to have to get at them with a little shovel or trowel. :bath:

Re: 90% Is Worthless! Rotting In Your Safe!
 

I'm assuming you're joking. You've been here long enough to know the D&F - $7-$7.50 - back up the truck - wait you'll see "melody". It's like whispering sweet nothings in your better half's ear. :D :tongue_ma:

MT Silver

Sorry.....I'm making absolutely no sense again. I'm an idiot like that. :bear_whistle: